שיחת משתמש:A. B. 10
w:User:A. B. • w:User talk:A. B.
meta:User:A. B. • meta:User talk:A. B.
--A. B. 10 00:00, 30 במאי 2007 (IDT)
warning[עריכת קוד מקור]
User, if you keep doing edits link this and this and this (and many more), where you have removed the link and leaved ugly text in the article, you will be blocked. Perhaps the bot you have should be upgraded - it does more damage than use. Yonidebest Ω Talk 22:43, 13 ביוני 2007 (IDT)
- Yonidebest, when I last checked, I was a human being, not a bot. I am sure I could use upgrading, however. That's what my siblings would say.
If you follow the link I left in all of my edit summaries (meta:Talk:Spam blacklist#700 URL redirection links to clean up), you will find out that all of the pages with those links will be locked up by the MediaWiki blacklisting filters in a day or two if those links are in place. While a window pops up to identify the problem, about half the time, editors seem to get confused and flustered, leading them to get flustered trying to fix the problem.
Since not every link with the co.nr domain is spam and since it's impossible to tell in advance which are and which aren't, I left disabled the links and left the description in place. Other editors may wish to delete the decription or they may wish to find an alternate link (usually one exists for these redirect links).
It would have been easier for me to just delete everything -- that's what I normally do with traditional spam that's being blacklisted.
Cleaning up the co.nr mess across 30 to 40 different Wikipedias has consumed 20 to 30 hours of various volunteers' time, especially mine.
Feel free to reinsert all those co.nr links now before blacklisting since you feel strongly about this. We've cleaned up every Wikipedia except en.wikipedia; it will take us at least 48 hours to clear those 450 links, so you've got time to get the links back before they're locked up.
Unrelated to co.nr, I was back today with a list of more links to clean up here. There are about 10 to 15 other pages on he.wikipedia with soon-to-be-blacklisted links involving other domains. I was going to delete them but perhaps I shouldn't now. You can review the list of domains listed at meta:Talk:Spam blacklist then look for pages on he.wikipedia with these links and handle (or not handle) them as you see fit. Given the increased tempo of both spamming and spam blacklisting, you can probably expect an average of about 5 pages a day to be affected going into the future.
I've made about 14,000 edits across multiple Wikimedia projects, all in good faith. You're the first person (other than a few vandals) to threaten me with blocking or even just a warning. --A. B. 10 07:27, 14 ביוני 2007 (IDT)
PS. I noticed you were interested in becoming an admin on en.wikipedia. Best of luck..- Hi, please excuse this misunderstanding. We have never seen a sequence of such edits so I'm sure you can appreciate they seem strange. I know you have provided the relevant meta link in the edit summary, and it's unfortunate we still had this mishap. Going forward, I would like to see how we can improve communications so we can solve such issues more efficiently. Had we been told of the upcoming blacklisting of this domain, we'd have been able to check each of the links and then either remove them altogether or replace them with a link to the final destination url. Who would be the right person for such future coordination? Cheers, odedee • שיחה 08:41, 14 ביוני 2007 (IDT)
- Like so much else on wikipedia, there is no designated person -- just a cheerful anarchy. In fact many people who request a domain be blacklisted don't bother with link cleanup, however I've seen the chaos that can happen after not cleaning up so it's an extra step I take to make things easier for other editors. And normally, link cleanup on "foreign" wikipedias goes smoothly, assuming one uses a registered account and leaves an edit summary since the deleted links are almost always worthless. This co.nr situation was unusual both in its scope and in the ambiguity of just how spammy each link might be. To the extent that I am ever involved in such another clean-up, I can always leave a message on some person's talk page here. --A. B. 10 09:09, 14 ביוני 2007 (IDT)
- Yes, the blissful anarchy... I know :) You are most welcome to notify me on my talk page should a similar need arise, or if you need any other assistance on HE WP. I just think it's easier for someone who speaks the language to check each link and either remove or fix it, rather than bother you with removing the http bit but keeping an unsightly url which still requires further cleanup. Regards, odedee • שיחה 11:05, 14 ביוני 2007 (IDT)
- Hi. If you don't mind, I added list bullets so your responses. Regarding the warning, A. B. 10, I have explained the rational of the warning in my talk page. Second, I must agree with odedee - once your remove the 'http' the link becomes broken and a user who wants to check the link has to copy and paste the link in his address browser. I think that it would be better if we received notice of such changes in advance. We have a village pump and a help desk for this. Also, we have our own whitelist, as does every other Wikipedia, and as such, we would might be interested in whitelisting a blacklisted link. Finally, I would like to apologize about the block warning. Your edits were quite like those of a bot's edits. If I have known you have done this work yourself, I would have turned to you in a different manner. Regards, Yonidebest Ω
- Yes, the blissful anarchy... I know :) You are most welcome to notify me on my talk page should a similar need arise, or if you need any other assistance on HE WP. I just think it's easier for someone who speaks the language to check each link and either remove or fix it, rather than bother you with removing the http bit but keeping an unsightly url which still requires further cleanup. Regards, odedee • שיחה 11:05, 14 ביוני 2007 (IDT)
- Like so much else on wikipedia, there is no designated person -- just a cheerful anarchy. In fact many people who request a domain be blacklisted don't bother with link cleanup, however I've seen the chaos that can happen after not cleaning up so it's an extra step I take to make things easier for other editors. And normally, link cleanup on "foreign" wikipedias goes smoothly, assuming one uses a registered account and leaves an edit summary since the deleted links are almost always worthless. This co.nr situation was unusual both in its scope and in the ambiguity of just how spammy each link might be. To the extent that I am ever involved in such another clean-up, I can always leave a message on some person's talk page here. --A. B. 10 09:09, 14 ביוני 2007 (IDT)
- Hi, please excuse this misunderstanding. We have never seen a sequence of such edits so I'm sure you can appreciate they seem strange. I know you have provided the relevant meta link in the edit summary, and it's unfortunate we still had this mishap. Going forward, I would like to see how we can improve communications so we can solve such issues more efficiently. Had we been told of the upcoming blacklisting of this domain, we'd have been able to check each of the links and then either remove them altogether or replace them with a link to the final destination url. Who would be the right person for such future coordination? Cheers, odedee • שיחה 08:41, 14 ביוני 2007 (IDT)
Talk 14:08, 14 ביוני 2007 (IDT)
I think it best that I just let you guys sort this out among yourselves. Yonidebest, you may want to start monitoring meta:Talk:Spam blacklist on your Meta watchlist -- there you'll find what's presently being blacklisted and you can act on them by whitelisting, deleting, or ignoring as you see fit. Perhaps you can develop a bot to do this -- it would eliminate a lot of drudgery for everyone. --A. B. 10 17:18, 14 ביוני 2007 (IDT)
דיון מהמזנון[עריכת קוד מקור]
המשתמש לעיל מסיר קישורים חיצוניים לכל מיני אתרים, בטענה שמדובר בספאם מסוג כלשהוא, נראה שהמשתמש אינו מבין עברית כך שלא ברור לי כיצד הוא יכול לשפוט מה ספאם ומה לא על פי הדומיין בלבד, בנוסף הוא מסיר את הקישור אך משאיר את כתובת האינטרנט גלויה, פעולה מיותרת מאוד לטעמי. יש פה איזה מדיניות חדשה שאני לא מכיר או שמדובר פה במזיק עם (אולי) כוונות טובות שצריך לעצור? בברכה, --איש המרק 10:38, 13 ביוני 2007 (IDT)
- למה לא שאלת אותו? גילגמש • שיחה 11:14, 13 ביוני 2007 (IDT)
- הוא פוגע רק בקישורים עם הסיומת nr, בכל מקרה, מומלץ לשאול אותו ולדרוש הסבר לעריכותיו. בברכה, MathKnight הגותי |Δ| (שיחה) 15:48, 13 ביוני 2007 (IDT)
- בידקו כאן. מסתבר שיש מדיניות נגד אתרים שהם קיצורי לינקים כמו nr. בברכה, MathKnight הגותי |Δ| (שיחה) 15:50, 13 ביוני 2007 (IDT)
- ראיתי את זה (הוא מפנה לדף הזה בכל עריכה), מה שלא ברור לי זה האם זאת אכן מדיניות (כי אפילו הוא כותב שם: "These additions are not necessarily spam -- some folks post them just to be helpful.") ואם כן, האם היא מחייבת אותנו? והאם למישהו נראה שהגישה של הסרת הקישור אבל השארת כתובת האתר הגיונית? את כל הדברים הללו לא היה כל כך טעם לשאול אותו, הוא כנראה מחוייב למטרה שלו, שלדעתי במקרים רבים *מזיקה* לויקי העברית, (שתי דוגמאות - [1] [[2] ). לדעתי, זהו סוג של קו מנחה, אבל כזה שעורך צריך לטפל בו ולא רובוט. בברכה, --איש המרק 18:09, 13 ביוני 2007 (IDT)
- בידקו כאן. מסתבר שיש מדיניות נגד אתרים שהם קיצורי לינקים כמו nr. בברכה, MathKnight הגותי |Δ| (שיחה) 15:50, 13 ביוני 2007 (IDT)
אנחנו לא מחויבים לשום דבר, וגם אם מוסיפים את האתר לרשימה השחורה אנחנו יכולים להוסיף אותו לרשימה לבנה מקומית ובכך לעקוף את החסימה שלו. יונתן שיחה 22:27, 13 ביוני 2007 (IDT)
פניתי למשתמש והזהרתי אותו. הוא משאיר עקבות מכוערות בערכים. זו לא צורה. Yonidebest Ω Talk 22:44, 13 ביוני 2007 (IDT)
I have responded on my talk page to Yondebest's concerns and his threat of a block. --A. B. 10 07:32, 14 ביוני 2007 (IDT)
- יש סיבה מצוינת לכך שהחליטו במטא לחסום את הדומיין הזה: הוא מציע שירות של קיצור לינקים כמו tinyurl, שדרכו אפשר להתגבר על מסנני הספאם של ויקימדיה. מאחר שעשויים להיות קישורים לאתרים כשרים שאנשים נתנו קיצורים אליהם, החליטו לא למחוק אותם לגמרי אלא רק לבטל את הפיכתם לקישור, כך שמסנן הספאם לא יפריע לשמור את אותם העמודים, ואפשר יהיה בהדרגה להחליף את הקישורים המקוצרים לקישורים לאתרי היעד. אכן קצת לא מוצלח שלא חשבו שכדאי להסביר למישהו כאן על העניין הזה, יכולנו לפתוח אסם קטן ולפתור את הבעיה בצורה טובה יותר. נקווה שלהבא נשתפר. odedee • שיחה 08:35, 14 ביוני 2007 (IDT)
- הבעיה היא שזה לא פרקטי לצפות ממישהו במטא לעבור על 40 ויקיפדיות ולכתוב הודעה במזנון (ואז כשההודעה משוחזרת לשים אותה במקום הנכון ולשכנע אנשים שמתנגדים וכו'). הבנאדם סה"כ ניסה לעזור וקיבל אזהרה לפני חסימה... יונתן שיחה 04:48, 15 ביוני 2007 (IDT)